bwRavencl Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 The X-VFR team proudly announces that a first version of the X-VFR Scenery is about to be realesed! After many hours of hard work and testing, we feel ready to show the results of our hard work to the public. X-VFR means that you can now navigate through the world of X-Plane by using your very own geographical knowledge. X-VFR uses the data of the so called OpenStreetMap (OSM) project. Many of you might have heard about OSM through Marginal's British roads scenery. But unlike the some other projects here at X-Plane.org, X-VFR does not focus on the streets and roads that are mapped. Our goal is to put the many buildings and structures that you can find on this free and accurate map with their exact GPS position into X-Plane. Shortly our project will provide a worldwide scenery with the exact position of the following objects: Radio towers Churches Cranes Gasometers Water towers Windmills Fossil power plants Coal power plants Nuclear plants Wind turbines Industrial factories To picture the mentioned structures in X-Plane, we benefit greatly from the OpenSceneryX project. To use X-VFR it is absolutely required to have installed the newest version of the OpenSceneryX library. You can download the installer at: http://www.opensceneryx.com For further information on how you can download the scenery package and contribute directly to the X-VFR project please consult our website at: http://xvfr.beomuex.org The X-VFR team wishes you a very happy and propserous New Year and of course a lot of fun with X-Plane! Drawn by Raven (Matteo Hausner) and beomuex (Maximilian Güntner) Visit our Screenshot album! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_L Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 You know what ? I am already doing that for France since 2006. I started with the list of obstacles provided by the SIA (Service de l'Information Aéronautique). I am trying to update this from time to time to take care of new and removed obstacles. You can find my work here : Obstacles France - 8.30+ And now with xposm I am generating the roads for France, Belgium and Luxembourg. I hope to upload this here next week. Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N_Altafini Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 great idea! awesome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsupnik Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 Hi Guys, I will only add that alpilotx has been helping me to look into collecting obstacle data for X-plane globally, in a manner similar to how the apt.dat files are done (e.g. a global repository, open source license, everyone can contribute). Daniel - I definitely want to find a way to integrate your data if it is possible and you are willing! I do not know how this would tie into X-VFR (or even if it would) -- but it is great to see X-VFR and others leveraging OSM! :-) cheers Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpilotx Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 OK, then I add in our OSM proposal for "aeroway_obstacles", which we started with Ben some weeks ago on the OSM Wiki. Our intention was to introduce an attribute schema to OSM which would allow to integrate obstacle specific informations. Well, you can read trough the proposal AND then see what all the OSM guys made about it. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Pr...eroway_obstacle Here is the discussion part: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Pr...eroway_obstacle As you can see, we stirred up quite a controversy, and for this reason Ben is thinking about going other ways for an open obstacle database. Andras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsupnik Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 (Raven - I'm sorry to hijack your thread here...) I must comment a little bit more on what Andras points to. Basically in our search for a good obstacle solution we are looking at 3 options: 1. Make our own "X-plane obstacle DB" like Robin does for apt.dat. 2. Use OSM as that DB. 3. Use FG's existing DB. Now option (1) seems silly when (3) exists - that is, why reinvent the wheel? But between FG and OSM, it appears that the FG guys err on the side of caution, quality control, and consistency, while OSM errs on the side of openness, anyone can do anything, etc. Now for the X-Plane global scenery I have two concerns that do not necessarily apply to third party add-ons: 1. We have to do the whole world, so we cannot manually check all of our work - with 19000 DSFs we must trust the data to be good going in. 2. We have professional training customers, for whom having incorrect data might be worse than not having data at all. These things point me towards FG over OSM...but I also can imagine data being shared between the two, with some quality control as data is moved around. Finally, nothing has been decided yet...I have been discussing this with some of the FG guys - they've been very helpful but we're still ironing out some details. cheers Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daveduck Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 1. Make our own "X-plane obstacle DB" like Robin does for apt.dat. 2. Use OSM as that DB. 3. Use FG's existing DB. Sorry--but I've missed the original reference--what's "FG"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpilotx Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Sorry--but I've missed the original reference--what's "FG"? FG = FlightGear (a fairly mature OpenSource flight sim). And here is their database which Ben is talking about: http://scenemodels.flightgear.org/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_L Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 ...Daniel - I definitely want to find a way to integrate your data if it is possible and you are willing!... It is okay to include my work. I am still updating my Excel sheet of the french obstacles. The online version is old now (march 2008). I will send you the last version by mail. About obstacles, I know a guy who is already collecting this data for all Europe for his own software. See Navigation at http://francois.fouchet.free.fr/. For your information, he already have a connection to X-Plane in Navigation. Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_L Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 These things point me towards FG over OSM...but I also can imagine data being shared between the two, with some quality control as data is moved around. About data, I think that FG will probably focus on the aeronautical source and OSM on the visual source. This could give different visions of the same thing. Example : wind turbines. In France the official aeronautical source (SIA = Service de l'Information Aéronautique) gives the center of the wind turbines group, their number and the radius. In OpenStreetMap you will probably find the coordinates of each wind turbine. Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsupnik Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Hi Guys, Daniel -- yes...this was one of the arguments that Andras and I had with the OSM guys...I feel that converting center-of-cluster data (for any multiple obstacle) into multiple nodes is "wrong" for databasing purposes because it basically invents erroneous synthetic data and then passes it off with no data-quality information. But this is probably moot anyway because...if data comes from two sources, we must always be prepared to have the same real entity listed in both sources slightly differently - thus there must be a process of removing duplicates that can be done with a "fuzzy" match. (I hit this in the global scenery now,where the FAA obstacle DB and tiger and Robin's nav data often list the same obstacles. In the raw data viewer I have, i can see "doubles" of the point features.) Re: FG - that is the FG database, but we are interested in the location data, _not_ the models! The goal here is not to have a standard set of custom art assets...rather to visualize a lot of obstacles using generic art assets. cheers ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beomuex Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Europe 0.1 has been released! Click here to get to the download page We hope you like it, The upcoming release will cover the American Continent (Canada and USA + South America). If you have question or suggestions, refer to the contact information on our side or post underneath. cheers beomuex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyholmes Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Europe 0.1 has been released! Click here to get to the download page We hope you like it, The upcoming release will cover the American Continent (Canada and USA + South America). If you have question or suggestions, refer to the contact information on our side or post underneath. cheers beomuex This looks really awesome from the sceen shots, is this scenery to install for the averge user, or is it some deep dark mysterious hackery that is for the benefit of creators. In other words, should a non-developer download this and get use from it? Cheers T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 All of these proposals sounds great... if there is an easy way to exclude a specific obstacle with a custom one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beomuex Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 This looks really awesome from the sceen shots, is this scenery to install for the averge user, or is it some deep dark mysterious hackery that is for the benefit of creators. In other words, should a non-developer download this and get use from it? Hi, it is indeed for the "normal" Xplane user.At the moment it doesn't include all the objects which are posible (why? read this) You only need to know how to install a generic Xplane Scenery Package (extract the zip to Custom Scenery ) Installing the OpensceneryX object is very easy with the installer you'll get from http://www.opensceneryx.com/ . All of these proposals sounds great... if there is an easy way to exclude a specific obstacle with a custom one... It is simple.But be careful, if you replace the object with a custom one, it will be replaced in every scenery that uses OpensceneryX, so better do a backup . Steps to replace (untested but it should work): 1. Find the object you want to replace (for example the church,X-Plane9.00/Custom Scenery/OpenSceneryX/objects/buildings/religious/churches/medieval/small) 2. rename the object already included in the folder, backup.obj 3. Copy your custom object into that folder 4. You're done I hope this works and will not be undone the next time you update your OpenSceneryX installation -- beomuex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwRavencl Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 This looks really awesome from the sceen shots, is this scenery to install for the averge user, or is it some deep dark mysterious hackery that is for the benefit of creators. In other words, should a non-developer download this and get use from it? Cheers T. There is no 'deep dark mysterious hackery' required. Just download and unpack in your Custom Scenery folder. Greets, Raven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean McLeod Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Europe 0.1 has been released! We hope you like it, The upcoming release will cover the American Continent (Canada and USA + South America). Excellent!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 It is simple.But be careful, if you replace the object with a custom one, it will be replaced in every scenery that uses OpensceneryX, so better do a backup . Steps to replace (untested but it should work): 1. Find the object you want to replace (for example the church,X-Plane9.00/Custom Scenery/OpenSceneryX/objects/buildings/religious/churches/medieval/small) 2. rename the object already included in the folder, backup.obj 3. Copy your custom object into that folder 4. You're done I hope this works and will not be undone the next time you update your OpenSceneryX installation -- beomuex Hi Sorry I missed your reply... I'm not actually talking about replacing a "generic" object with another one... but the removal of a generic one to replace it with a specific one, for a single location as per reality. For example lets say your pack included a generic obstacle for the Tour d'Eiffel... and that clashed with an exact model of the Tour d'Eiffel in a scenery pack.... I certainly don't want every obstacle to look like the Tour d'Eiffel... (not saying it isn't pretty)... Some sort of index for each object is needed? and a way to remove them on a specific object by object basis. I hope that clears up my point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marginal Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 For example lets say your pack included a generic obstacle for the Tour d'Eiffel... and that clashed with an exact model of the Tour d'Eiffel in a scenery pack....In your scenery package that contains a "real" Tour d'Eiffel you can add an exclusion region around the generic obstacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwRavencl Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 In your scenery package that contains a "real" Tour d'Eiffel you can add an exclusion region around the generic obstacle. And even this isn't necessary for an object like the Tour d'Eiffel. At the moment we only support the following objects: * Radio towers * Churches * Cranes * Gasometers * Water towers * Windmills * Fossil power plants * Coal power plants * Nuclear plants * Wind turbines * Industrial factories And the Tour d'Eiffel isn't one of those. It can be more of a problem with sites like St. Peter's Basilica in Rome. OpenStreetMap calls all churches "Amenity=Place of Worship", that's why a standard church will appear at the position of the St. Peter's Basilica. I hope that answers your question. -- Raven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyholmes Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 There is no 'deep dark mysterious hackery' required. Just download and unpack in your Custom Scenery folder. Greets, Raven So I just drop the "Earth Nav Data" into the root of "Custom Scenery"? Or did I miss something? Cheers T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwRavencl Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 So I just drop the "Earth Nav Data" into the root of "Custom Scenery"? Or did I miss something? Cheers T. -First of all you' ll have to visit http://www.opensceneryx.com and download the OpenSceneryX installer. This will istall a library of objects that are used by our scenery. -Then you'll have to extract our scenery into your Custom Scenery folder. The folder structure must be: ...\X-Plane 9\Custom Scenery\_Europe_XVFR\Earth nav data\... -This means that you have to extract he complete '_Europe_XVFR' folder into your 'Custom Scenery' folder! That's all. Feel free to ask me again, if any problems occur! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 And even this isn't necessary for an object like the Tour d'Eiffel. At the moment we only support the following objects: * Radio towers * Churches * Cranes * Gasometers * Water towers * Windmills * Fossil power plants * Coal power plants * Nuclear plants * Wind turbines * Industrial factories And the Tour d'Eiffel isn't one of those. It can be more of a problem with sites like St. Peter's Basilica in Rome. OpenStreetMap calls all churches "Amenity=Place of Worhsip", that's why a standard church will appear at the position of the St. Peter's Basilica. I hope that answers your question. -- Raven I think you got my point... You learn something new everyday... must be some other 1173 ft radio mast on the Paris chart? I never knew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 In your scenery package that contains a "real" Tour d'Eiffel you can add an exclusion region around the generic obstacle. rgr that marginal, however, Understood depending on weather "with higher priority" applies... My original point was sort of broader.. I'm not the Author of 648 of the 652 custom scenery packs in my "custom scenery folder". The fact that any "Global" scenery pack has potential conflicts with every other scenery pack ever made might be considered an issue? Sorry if i think we need some better way co-operating, controlling, co-ordinating such conflicts... Cheers Viking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwRavencl Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 I think you got my point... You learn something new everyday... must be some other 1173 ft radio mast on the Paris chart? I never knew @Viking beomuex just notified me, that i was wrong about the Tour d'Eiffel, in our current version of the scenery, all so called man made towers are shown as standard radio towers in X-Plane. I just double-checked this and the Tour d'Eiffel is of course marked as a 'man made tower'. I falsely assumend that we used a special radio tower tag for the radio towers in X-Plane. But still Marginal was right, about what he stated with the exclusion zones. Please excuse me for talking nonsense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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